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Topic: A Mare that Throws large. (Read 1608 times)
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Kim Turner
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Novice
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Posts: 39
The journey... That's the reward!
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Hi Everyone,
I need some help with a broodmare that I might possibly buy. The mare is by E.H. Consul, out of a full-sister to the stallion Mahon. She is 16.3 h tall and is full-bodied and a bit heavy boned. She also throws BIG babies. Most of them are in the 16.3 - 17.2 h range. The current stallion that she is being bred to seems to throw (at least to me) babies that mature quickly. It is not unusual to see the get of this stallion in the showring easily by the age of 3 1/2. The problem that we are having is that when you combine the size that the mare throws with the speed of maturation that the stallion seems to produce, one can end up with some foals that are effected by OCD.
My guess is that I need a stallion that adds the refinement and movement that I want (upper level dressage abilities) but that grows slowly. I was looking at Shagya Arabs as a possibility as most Arabs are slow growers. Most of the Trakehner stallion owners that I have contacted do not like admitting that their stallions are slow growers. For some reason, they are thinking that this is a flaw.
I know that there are stallions and/or lines out there that are slower maturing. I have a 6 year old gelding that was very slow. There was no way that he could have stepped into the showring as a 3 1/2 year old. He is great now, but I could not push him any faster without running into problems.
Any ideas ??
Thanks for the input,
Kim
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Tannenwald Trakehner
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Old Hand
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Posts: 935
TANZBRISE by Windfall out of Tariana
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Of the horses we have had, our Impressionist filly seems the slowest growing. Her dam is a Graditz daughter out of an Avignon daughter, and that mare grew almost 3 inches after she turned 4. Her Kaspareit filly got most of her growth early, and the Impressionist filly is very slow maturing. From looking at the Impressionist kids on the Valhalla site, I think that they are slow growing (or just finish small!) in general.
Kim, why is she not a candidate for Tzigane?
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Navar
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Try Oskar II. You should get the refinement you want and a slower maturing horse, plus the upper level dressage capabilities. He was first a gran prix jumper but is now competing at gran prix dressage. I have his video and was impressed.
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shadytrake
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Gold Medallist
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Posts: 263
I LOVE Trakehners!
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My new baby (1 1/2 year old Anglo-Trake) is from the Graditz line too. He is a slow grower. I haven't sticked him yet, but plan on measuring him this week to chart his growth. He is small for his age, but I have patience 
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DK
FEI
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Posts: 138
Kammerland Trakehners
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How about Puszta's Diamant? His babies mature VERY slowly. I have a filly by him (16.2 hands) out of my TB mare (16.1 1/2) and she is only 15 hands at 2 years old. I seen maybe 5-6 of his offspring and they are all really small for a long time. One of his daughters was 15 hands at 3, 15.2 at 4, 16.1 at five and finished at 16.3 at 6. That's seems to be about the normal growth rate for his kids. They are deceiving though, because at every growth stage they look very, very proportionate and uphill. They look very mature at 3 years old, but definitely are not. I'm not doing anything with my fill until she's 4-4.5.
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sherry
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FEI
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Posts: 223
I love Trakehners!
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Kim-
I've seen a few Puzta's babies--they are all gorgeous--but I've not seen one with a brain--what has been your experience? I'm told that a stallion by Puzta who had not been to the approvals was gelded recently and is taking the hunter world by storm.
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Eileen
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Old Hand
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Posts: 523
I LOVE Trakehners!
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I have a Putza granddaughter and you couldn't ask for a sweeter temperament, more willing or easier to train attitude. This mare was a brood mare only until I bought her at age 12. I had her at Valhalla for breeding before I brought her home. While there, I asked Jean to have someone start her for me. They had a working student ride her, the student fell in love with her and commented on how hard the mare tried. When I brought her home, my riding instructor (having dealt with about every breed except Traks) expected the "typical broodmare" attittude. She was amazed at how willing this mare is and how quickly she catches on. When startled or frightened, her biggest reaction is to stop, look, and snort. I now have a Stiletto colt who shares these traits. Coming from the Arab world and realizing how smart and willing those horses are, I was very pleased to find the same attitudes and traits in the Trakehner breed. This is my first Trak so maybe there is more that others have that my mare doesn't, but I don't know what it could be.
As to the slow maturing from the Putza line, my colt is 14.2 at 9 months. I'm trying to slow him down.
Another stallion you may consider is Carino at Rappenhof. Connie readily admits his line is slow maturing.
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DK
FEI
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Posts: 138
Kammerland Trakehners
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I have both a Puszta daughter and a Puszta granddaughter. I also worked at the farm where Pustza lived from the time of her importation to the time she passed away. Her ATA approved son resides there, too. I have had the priveledge of riding several of Puszta's daughters and find no basis to say that they are unintelligent. They were all focused, patient, hard workers, and gave 110% everytime. I would like to know which Puszta babies you have been exposed to that led you to conclude they are brainless. I've certainly never seen it. I was impressed enough to breed to Puszta's Diamant and now have a lovely INCREDIBLY intelligent 2 year old. I put a saddle on her the other day just to see what she'd do and she let me put it on, girth it up, and lead her around the property with nary a protest. And to quote Erhard, you we all can agree knows his Trakehners:
"Puszta's daughter Pillkallen by Mahagoni,born in '84 stil presents that family on a very high quality level her in germany.she is not only on of the best daughters of the legendary mahagony she represented our breed as a multiple champion on several national shows.And her daughter Perkallen by Friedensfürst became the highest graded mare in 2002 with the scores of 8.5 for type,8.5 for conformation,7.0 for legs,8.0 for walk,10.0 for trot,8.5 for canter and 9.0 for overall impression.One of the highest graded mares ever,and having loked at her you will never forget her.A perfect combination of 1st class riding horse and modern broodmare type too.She won her performance test with highest scores too."
Puszta must have done something right. I also know the now gelding you are referring to; I considered buying him, in fact. He is a lovely mover and appears to have a lovely temperament. That is one consistent trait Puszta and her offspring throw, a calm, level-headed temperament.
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sherry
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FEI
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Posts: 223
I love Trakehners!
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thanks for letting me know about some great Puzta babies--truth is most of my experience has been with colts--so much for gross generalizations. I certainly agree that he's as beautiful a boy as comes around--
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Sovereign Farm
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Gold Medallist
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Posts: 481
KALUA by Heling
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I have a big, old style mare in foal to the Arabian stallion Aul Magic. He really is nice and I hope that more Trakehner mare owners will use him as a sire before he gets too old. It will be interesting to see how this foal will turn out. We are expecting the foal in the next 3 weeks or so, and I'll put pictures up in the announcement section. Good luck!
Heather
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Duxelle
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This may be a little off the subject, but I would like to lease a Trakehner broodmare for breeding to Tzigane to produce a dressage prospest. My first warmblood (long ago) was a Trakehner. Since then, I've ridden or owned horses from most of the other warmblood breeds, and there's never been another one like the Trakehner. I can provide references as to the excellent care this mare would receive. I'm located in the upper midwest. Thanks to any of you that can help with this request.
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khunter
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I think the Kim asking this question was mistaken for me. Of course if the mare was mine she'd be booked to Tzigane.
In fact, I'm breeding a mare very like Kim's to Taz this year. She's 17h HUGE-bones (Abdullah X Rahel/Ergo). Saw Sue Williams at the approvals in Florida who told me this mare's dam was also incredibly big-boned. My mare has had two foals - one by Graditz who was still approx. 15.2h at 4 yrs., the other by an Oldenburg stallion and was 16.2h at 2 yrs!
Guess that's the long way to say that I agree the Graditz line seems to mature more slowly.
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